From Homelessness to Prison to Financial Freedom through Real Estate with Mark Owens

Speaker 1

00:00

 In this episode of the form adversity, to abundance podcast, I sit down with actually I am standing. But I interview Mark Owens. Who's a successful real estate investor from Baltimore my neck of the woods and it is no exaggeration to say that the previous podcast I had mark on where interviewed mark on The Good Deeds, note investing podcast that episode literally prompted me to get the Gears turning and the wheels spinning to actually start this podcast. It literally, it just blew me away. I listen to that episode several times, which is not the norm. And, you know, I definitely recommend listeners, go back and listen to The Good Deeds episode where I talked to Mark back in, I think December late, December, 20, 21 and I had reached out to Mark and just based on his own his real estate success. And, you know, the fact that we're from The General, The same local area. Generally speaking, I had heard of him and seen a bunch of his YouTube videos and things like that and just seem like a good guy. So I think I would hear him on a couple podcast as well but I reached out to him and I didn't know until two minutes before we hit record for the good deeds episode that we were going to get into such craziness as far as his background. And I mean, just unbelievable stories, and we get into much of that here today. He overcame he's overcome a Ton of adversity in his life. I mean, this is really an episode that just his story just blows me away from, you know, drug addiction to robberies, and bank robberies, and craziness. And, you know, relationships gone wrong and things like that and somehow he fought through it and, you know, made his way to abundance and now he's financially free, and he's basically trying to figure out, you know, how to fill his day. Days because he's can do whatever he wants, which is awesome. So, we don't focus a ton on the real estate ins and outs in this episode because this show is really about mindset and overcoming adversity and understanding that, you know, we all go through trials and tribulations, but we can get to a mindset of abundance and to a life of abundance and Mark is a huge Testament to that possibility. And that, that the fact that the mindset plays, such a big role in this in that path. In that a journey. So, you know, I can't do it anymore Justice. I just love this. This his story both on the Good Deeds episode. And I love this episode here and I definitely want to have Mark back on, and he's somebody that is just so passionate and so genuine and his whole goal now is to help others which is awesome. So super, super grateful that Mark was able to join me and I hope you enjoyed the episode just like I did. Thanks. Boring stories of real people. Overcoming incredible odds to live life to the fullest. We are all guaranteed to face. Hardships, how will we handle the adversity? Join us to be moved by every day, people who have turned poverty into prosperity and weakness into wealth Be Inspired as these relatable Heroes, get vulnerable and former counterintelligence investigator Jamie Bateman puts his interviewing skills to the test, restore your faith in humanity as you experience. True Cinderella. Or he's of average people. Turning surreal struggle and deep despair into booming, businesses and financial Fortune. Take ownership of the life. You are destined to live and.

Speaker 2

03:41

 Turn your adversity.

Speaker 1

03:43

 Into abundance. Welcome everybody. To our first episode of the form adversity, to abundance podcast. I am your host Jamie Bateman. I am really excited about launching this podcast, and I am really excited about our guest today as well. So, our guests is markup, Mark Owens. Excuse me, Mark, how are you doing today?

Speaker 2

04:17

 Awesome, Jamie. Thank you.

Speaker 1

04:19

 Yeah. Mark, we had, we had mark on The Good Deeds show. I think it was late December. About three months ago and I am not kidding. When I say Mark your episode really inspired me enough so that I am actually launching this podcast, I would say largely because of that episode and episode similar to it. You know we didn't dive into real estate too much you know. But it was more of a mindset and you know, overcoming adversity type episode and it really did inspire me to kind of think bigger. And launch this podcast. So I am really excited. But this episode is not about me. It's about you. So for our listeners marked, if you could, it's about you and our listeners. But if you could want you, tell us what your current situation, and then we will jump back to your.

Speaker 2

05:13

 Backstory. Sure. Catches the first thing I want to say is that I really, really am honored and appreciate the fact that you invited me on and it means a lot to me. It truly does because that's what I feel. Like my purpose is at this stage in my life is to inspire other people, and show them what's possible and help them to develop a life of their dreams, whatever their dreams are. And, so I really appreciate the opportunity to help us literally you know, possibly you know, positively influence. People. So yeah, I love it's forward as far as where I am at today. I am 56 that's turn 57 years old married for 20. I think five years, my wife has trouble, keeping track to so it's not let me see. I have been a full time real estate investor for close to 20 years. Got a son, he's doing amazing. He's in his early 20s. He's living.

Speaker 1

06:12

 In Charlotte. North Carolina is working in.

Speaker 2

06:14

 Investment. The bag. My wife is now a travel nurse, we're traveling around the country, she does a three-month gig at one place and in the three-month gigs from Ross were currently in Charleston, South Carolina, which is where I am right now.

Speaker 1

06:25

 The weather's nicer. We got a yeah, you're from Baltimore. I am from the Baltimore area, as well. I just got a notification on my phone about the snow coming in today, and it's a March 30th. So imagine the weather's a little nicer down there.

Speaker 2

06:41

 I think it's gonna be like 76 today. Nah. He's all right. Awesome, it's all good. Yeah. So that's what we're doing now. I was at want to back up just to the beginning of the real estate stuff. Like I started buying Reynolds 2002. I bought my first one is timely history, right? A little over 100 units and then I started downsizing the market was like you know, doing really well and I had a lot of interest from out-of-town investors that were cash buyers without paying Real Estate Commission. So it is Literally saved me hundreds of thousands of dollars in real estate commission's just by doing these direct sales.

Speaker 1

07:18

 To people at what I?

Speaker 2

07:19

 Consider retail prices. So I ended up scaling down, I have got about 30 units now, okay, 31 somewhere in that range and I don't have any debt to, you know, any debt, except for my Visa, which I use for everything. Just so I can track my spending expenses.

Speaker 1

07:38

 Sharing to pay that off every month and.

Speaker 2

07:41

 And I spend a lot of my time just you know, like trying to find stuff to do, like I am trying to learn photography. I try to learn Spanish for a while but like I just no comprende. I am just.

Speaker 1

07:51

 Terrible at. It's.

Speaker 2

07:52

 Not happened. It was just, you know, just, so I am just like, spending my time trying to find things to do. I started doing some coaching but it that's very limited. I am only taking a few people at a time and all that, because if it starts to feel like a job, and I am not going to want to do it, if I don't do it, I am not going to give 100%. And if I don't give 100% Going to feel like s*** because I am going to feel like I am ripping somebody off. So it's like, I don't want to, I am not trying to have like a volume of like, you know, 50 people a month signups, like just a couple of months.

Speaker 1

08:24

 And the height at the height of your real estate kind of investing. What did that look like?

Speaker 2

08:31

 Ice off manage my units? Which a lot of people like, you know, they're just like, they just can't believe it or like, how do you do it? But I mean, I am telling you like I built up a bunch of systems. And processes where I managed it. And it the height of my unit count is probably like a hundred seven units.

Speaker 1

08:49

 I multifamily or just carried.

Speaker 2

08:51

 Single-family, a Maltese Dominican, got it. Like, I could say, I have one building but the one building has 18 Apartments. So I would say that's 18 units and.

Speaker 1

09:01

 These were all in Baltimore City.

Speaker 2

09:02

 Everything in Baltimore City God, and at the peak, I was, I wasn't working any more than two or three hours a day. And the way that I was able to do that was Just figured out like when something happened that I had to do and I didn't like it. I try to figure out a way to get somebody else to do it. Either. Automate it or get something. So like just the easiest example, is a tenant calls up and maybe they complain. That stove isn't working. Well, I could get stuck in this phone call Loop. Where, tell attend. Okay, let me call you back and then I follow the appliance repair company, and they say, okay, Tuesday at noon. All right, let me call you back and then I call the tenant back, and she says she can't do Tuesday, she can do Thursday and you get stuck in. That sure. Yeah, well, it's happened, you know, so many times that I finally just said systems going to give a damn Senate to number two, the repair company, and she can call them out of it. I am a diagrammatic 17 phone calls by giving her the number. The same thing with, you know, with the plumber, the electrician, the furnace guy, the Exterminator. It's like just give the tenant empower the tenant to call. I am paying for it since I get a call saying anything, and then they can find a time that works good for them. Yeah. And it just I just built my whole business around.

Speaker 1

10:11

 And I have seen some of your YouTube videos and things and it just comes across that you your tenants were and I have heard you on other podcasts as well, but your tenants seems like you had a work, a good relationship with your tenants. You guys were on the same team. They weren't it wasn't an adversarial relationship. Is that fair to say?

Speaker 2

10:30

 I would say that, that is true. The majority of the time, I mean, I try to work with my tenants as customers not as adversaries and a lot of landlords will get there, it's like me. Insta tenant. I am just like, hey, these are my customers. I want Happy customers. I want my tenant to live in this house for 20 years. One of the pay, the rent on time, but even if they're late now, and then like vacancies, kill you turnovers kill you. I want you to stay there. Yeah, no forever. I want our grandchildren to grow up in that house and part of the way that you do. That's just treat them with the same respect that you treat your accountant or your attorney.

Speaker 1

11:03

 No, that's, that's what I do. I treat everybody the.

Speaker 2

11:06

 Same. I treat, I don't care if it's a section eight moms, with four kids from four different fathers. Or, you know, my, I don't know, my title attorney, or my accountant or bookkeeper treat. I treat them all with the same amount of.

Speaker 1

11:17

 Respect, and I think that there's a way that's actually a really good, probably a good segue into your backstory, I think, because, I mean, you know, I try to do that as well, right? And sounds good. And it's, and it's, but it's sometimes easier said than done. I mean, I think that your backstory in particular you have been through. You have seen, you know, we will get into that. That, but you have seen a lot of different things and you have kind of lived at different, maybe levels as far as financial success, and you have experienced a lot of hardship and, and been exposed to a lot of different kind of segments of the population if you will. And I think maybe I don't want to put words in your mouth, but maybe that helped you appreciate, you know, person for a person, and they all have everybody has value. And so with that, why don't we dive into your back story? If you don't mind? Because I again this when we got into this on the Good Deeds, show it really did blow me away, so I think our listeners are going to really benefit from this so if you could dive into your backstory for us.

Speaker 2

12:23

 Okay? So I was born in 1965 Baltimore city grew up in a blue-collar mostly white neighborhood working class there was where I was growing up like the dream of like 10 11. 12 year old boys was to get a job driving a forklift at a factory. Like that's as far as we could see it again. And if you can, if you get a job driving a forklift that knocks out or Pepsi like you're set, like you're set for life because then you can go buy your little row house. You know with like two maybe three bedrooms have a couple of kids and, you know, one car, because it back in the seventies, most families just had.

Speaker 1

13:00

 One car. So your hand really?

Speaker 2

13:01

 Yeah. And you could live, you know, a happy middle class life and that was our dream. And I had never really felt like, I just thought, like, Could be more than that. There's got to be more than just driving a forklift and but I was too young to really visualize that and my family structure. I was an only child mother had me when she was 17. Quit school work at a factory. Didn't meet my biological father, and I was like 17. He was a junkie in and out of jail and you know, just a bad guy. And I had another stepfather for a few years and that didn't work out. Then I get Another stepfather. But him and I never really related because he was like, he went to college, it was like, like, nobody in my neighborhood went to college. It's like, who is this guy? You know? Against I never really felt like I fit in and so what happened was, you know, we had drug education in school like in elementary school and you're there and you're looking at the pictures and you're hearing these stories and you know, you're thinking like, oh my God, I would never do that. There's people crazy. Like my God, why would you do that? And then I will I was like 12 years old and one of my friends asked me if I want to smoke some pot, and I am thinking like this is a chance for me to fit in because I never really felt like I fit in, and so I did.

Speaker 1

14:25

 So I got a question. It was the Dare program.

Speaker 2

14:29

 No, there was I don't think there was a dare program back. Okay. This was like, literally, like 1975 got.

Speaker 1

14:35

 It. The reason I ask is, I did some studies in criminal, justice back in the day, really didn't end up doing anything with it. But and I remember one of the things, you know, there you can argue both sides to almost every type of Criminal Justice policy and education, different, you know, government policies, there're pros and cons to everything. Well, I remember the Dare program Particular actually stood out as having no positive effect, if and, and potentially negative effect because it exposed kids to things, they wouldn't have been exposed to that's a whole separate. Yeah story. But it's interesting.

Speaker 2

15:15

 Yeah, my neighborhood. It was very easy to get exposed. Like I said, I was, I was smoking when I was 12 years old and so worried. And so, we're all my friends. So, so by the time I was 12 years old and smoking weed. Smoking cigarettes and Something happened that changed my relationship with my parents forever. You know, my mom up and said pointed, always told me, you know, like if I ever like, smoke cigarettes or like anything, like that, like, it's come talk to her about it and I trusted her. And she so I started smoking cigarettes. This was before I started smoking weed. Hmm, and I went and talked to my mom, I said, Mom and you know, I want to talk to you, you know, I smoked a couple of cigarettes and you told me if I ever did anything like that, It's come talk to you and then she started screaming on me, telling me. I was stupid. Made me chew up a cigarette and completely humiliated me. And that changed our relationship up till today where I no longer saw her is a friend or Confidant or something. I could talk to my stars the enemy because she stabbed me in the back, and she told me to come talk to her and then I will come talk to her, and she humiliates me and I think that may have also been partially with led me to saying yes when I had the opportunity to smoke weed, got it. Then he now started you know she found out, I was getting high. We ended up moving out of Baltimore City. Baltimore County, which was at the time a lot different from it is. Now is a lot more innocent a lot more naive. I was a city kid coming out to the suburbs and I felt like that my classmates, even though we were the same age, I just felt like they were little kids, you know, like I mean when the street I grew up on the river, I think, you know, one of my best friend's father's was shot on the corner. A couple years later, another one of my friends. His girlfriend's mother was stabbed to death up the street from my house. I mean, it said and then I come out to Perry Hall and it was almost like a Leave it to Beaver kind of neighborhood. Like very like just different, you know, send right? Yeah. It seemed like it to me. And, so I was a bad kid, you know I started then my drug use started to escalate where, you know, it was like went from we the drinking to, you know, all the pills and, you know, inhalants and everything. I could get my hands on. I was kind of speed through this but you know I failed. The 10th grade went to a couple years of summer. School ended up getting kicked out of high school in November of my senior year and this that was very defiant and resented Authority. And you know, didn't want to hear like people telling me what to do and I don't know where that came from, but it was there and you know, the vice principal called me into his office. And you know, about my truancy, which was chronic. And he told me the next time I taught a class, he was gonna, you know, suspend me to the Board of Education with a recommendation for expulsion, and I thought that was like a challenge to me, say, give me my past, get back to class and I walked out the front door and of the school. And then, the next day, I go back to school. When I get my, I get suspended with a, you know, recommendation for explosion. And I went home. I left that on my Kitchen table in my house. I packed up my stuff. And then I moved down to my grandmother's house, which was back down in the city and the neighborhood that I grew up in. And I was a drug addict, you know, I was very good at manipulating people and my mother, and her mother had some issues. I was very good at putting a wedge there and making it look like, I am the good guy, my mother's the bad guy. So my grandmother took me in but there was Zero structure there and I just, I thought that. Okay, look, I am gonna quit school, and then we will get a job. I am gonna, you know, I am gonna get a job, make some money because this stops waste of my time. I mean, how many times can you learn about?

Speaker 1

19:09

 The same s***?

Speaker 2

19:10

 Year after Hereafter. Yeah, we're doing an another semester in American history. We had their symmetrical American history for the last six years. It's like, yeah, yeah. And.

Speaker 1

19:22

 I remember not, I have gotten more into history now not super into it but I can relate to that. I was like well what does it mean to me? I can't change anything about what happened.

Speaker 2

19:32

 Exactly. And when you're a kid, you don't understand that, you know, like now you can look back and you can see the history and you can see that how it tends to repeat and I try to learn from it but you know, right, you know what, it's not us individually but as our society and our politician.

Speaker 1

19:47

 Yes, keep no idea. The same tried and care and other.

Speaker 2

19:50

 But I just.

Speaker 1

19:52

 Sorry go ahead. I think there.

Speaker 2

19:53

 Was I got out of it, I got out of school. Couldn't that's okay. It couldn't get a good job or anything like that and it just kept doing my drug stuff and then I was 17 years old. It was I remember his February 1982 and I remember this because I actually work on Mike Because I was proud of it. The first time I saw was a friend of mine, I saw his brother shooting Coke In his bedroom. And I asked him, I was like, man, like how much is that? And he said was $25, work order Grand was like, well, how many shots do you get? He said to, I was thinking to get one and I did. He said, Manuel sell me some of his So I did a shot of coke. Then I did my the other one like 10, 15 minutes later and that really changed things. Because up, until that point, I had done some bad stuff. I would stolen cars, I would broken into some houses. I had broken into schools and stole like triple beam scales and stuff like that but because that's what all the drug dealers like you could trade it for drugs is really easy transaction. So the But that changed everything because you know what happens when you start to do stuff like that. As you think about if I ever, you know, things ever start getting bad, I will just quit like I would never let it get that bad. I mean that's what everybody that. That weighs 400 pounds says, I will never let myself get that fat, you know, and then years later, there they are. And so it's very, it's the same trap whether it's your talking about your weight, which a lot of people in America can relate to or the drugs off you say, you will never let yourself get to that point and then you do and it's very gradual. So you don't really notice it because it's just a little bit more, little bit more. And, so I started shooting Coke and then like a month later, I found out another guy that I knew was doing heroin. And I thought I would like to try that out. I Like Cocaine heroin is probably pretty decent to and, you know, called him up, and it up, you know, that day or the next day, try and heroin for the first time. So, by the time I turned 18, I was already shooting Coke and heroine, and he is that give the short story but over the next few years, you know, it was in and out of jails rehabs Living in the street, you know, an abandoned houses sleeping under bridges. You know, I got stuck in California, had to hitchhike from California to Baltimore with no money. Got kicked out of a drug rehab and in Virginian and it was like it was Winter and it's like violated my probation. I am gonna get a prison for four years for violating my probation. So my choices either go back to Baltimore and go to jail or go somewhere else and my thoughts are. Well from a live outside. I am going to be homeless, I am going south, so I hitchhiked the Florida. And wound up in Jacksonville, Florida. Which is like, literally, like the home of the homeless mean, there are so many homeless people there, and I think that's because a lot of people hitchhike to Florida, or drive there, whatever. That's the first big city that they hit. And there's a lot of resources. If you're like, living in a street, there's a lot of missions and shelters and, you know, stuff like that. So there's a lot of resources there for people that are like, down-and-out.

Speaker 1

23:07

 Right? So it's there's a good thing, but it ends up drawing more.

Speaker 2

23:13

 Homeless. It's good. It was good for Me, I don't live there.

Speaker 1

23:41

 I was talking my daughter, my daughter's 14, she's almost 15. We were talking about drugs and, you know, it's like I don't have a ton of experience with that, you know, myself. But I haven't heard a lot of people who say, oh, I just I am experimenting. I guess they say I am experimenting but it's like well does that ever turn out positively, and I am not, I am not judging here. I am just saying didn't for me, if you experiment with Heroin that usually I haven't heard anyone say hello, I am really glad I Did that, you know, in hindsight, the experiment worked out well it's like, you know, it doesn't go well.

Speaker 2

24:18

 Right ma'am. Listen, I agree with you 100% but here's the other part that people don't talk about, is it people usually start with weed, gotcha? Yeah. I am not saying that we'd leads to heroin, right? Because it's not we don't do anything. We'd is just a drug it's but it what it does is it opens us up to. Well, what's the next step? What's yeah, it's not pots fault because There were a million decisions that I made as an individual between the first time I smoked weed. The first time I shot Coke, you know that said, I don't blame pot for this at all. It's just, I mean, this is 100% my fault, but let me I want to fast-forward through a little bit because when you get to the part that was, I think the most important thing, I am just going to fast-forward to the summer of 1989 when my drug use reached like the part where I was at the In return. I ended up I robbed the bank in Philadelphia outside of Philadelphia 1989, and I was already out on bail for doing another like a theft. I think it was, I think they charged me to strong-arm robbery were to visit ventually. Drop the theft. I was out on bail for that. I need the money to pay my rent. My girlfriend like was, you know, really, you know, pissed off and all that again because I f***** up again. And I just decided like, man, I am just going to go rob a bank, you know, that's it. So I went I will tell you how I used to steal cars. I don't like I will tell you how I did it. People can figure it out. And remember what I used to do is, and I am still a lot of cars. I would, I would find like an apartment building in the area of where I was at and I we get the address and then I would call a pizza delivery place and I would say, back in the pay phones, right? You put a right here like time. It might have gone up to a quarter, I put a dime in it, call the pizza place and say, Hey I want a large pepperoni pizza. I am at 41. Buchanan Avenue Apartment G. Notice it across the street, 40 minutes later, the pizza guy pulls up. They always leave the engine running always because we're in a hurry. Sure, I will sit across my screen. See the guy get out, the pizza, run in opens the apartment building door starts running up. The steps I go hop in his car and take off. That's how I used to steal cars, and sometimes I get a free pizza too. I mean, it was awesome.

Speaker 1

26:42

 Bonus. So then books in like, might sound like a dumb question, but You do it, the car at that.

Speaker 2

26:48

 Point. I would, I would use it to go rob, whatever I was going to rob whether around drug dealer or, you know, usually I use my own car for drug dealers because they already movie anyway, but for the, you know, for the bank and for other places, I was robbing, I was just stealing cars and I would you actually use them for a couple of days because there are so many. I am like, police aren't actually out like looking for them. They find the stolen car, when it's in an accident or, you know, something like that. Are you get pulled over because you were speeding or ran a red light or something? So that's how you find them there. Not actually out like looking for them at least in a big city like Baltimore. Maybe if you're in a small town or something, they might but big city like Baltimore. They're not they got too much other stuff to worry.

Speaker 1

27:27

 About. So the you rob this Bank.

Speaker 2

27:31

 Robbed the bank and it was like the next day my girlfriend didn't know about it. You know, I paid the rent, you know, got a bunch of money hidden in a kitchen and nobody knows. But me and I friend in Baltimore that I told and the next morning, it was like 5:00 in the morning, 6:00 in the morning, we get a knock on the door. And we're laying in their sleep. In a, my girlfriend goes up and answers the door and it was a sheriff or one of the deputies and the bail bondsman, and they were revoking my bail because apparently one of my girlfriend's friends called them up and said I was going to like leave the state and abscond from Justice bless you. So the so you know, they you know, I am just like look I was a drug addict, I am very good at manipulating people. Very good, you know, sizing people up and making like, quick decisions on how to respond to the people.

Speaker 1

28:24

 Sure. And that's just one of the.

Speaker 2

28:25

 Benefits that you get from living that lifestyle and smarts.

Speaker 1

28:28

 Kind of right and get people emotion. I guess, whatever they call that an emotional and intellectual intelligence. Yeah, mine was on fire. And I.

Speaker 2

28:39

 Just thought, like I am sitting there, and I am like okay sort of take me back to jail. I am like okay what am I get? The f*** out of this. How am I going to do it? And like I just need to buy some time to just think about this. So I was very courteous with the guys, I was very non-confrontational, nothing like okay, no problem and can't let me get me, get dressed, you know, just asking permission. And I remember like up, and I was a cocky. I was a cocky little punk, and I am remembered like, you know, tying my shoes and I looked at my girlfriend and I winked at her, and she didn't know what I was, you know, she had no idea, but I am like, man, I am getting the f*** out here. Like, I am tying like I am getting dressed to Run. I am not getting dressed to go to jail. I am putting a loose-fitting clothing up tying my shoes tight like I am getting the f*** out of here and then I didn't know how I was going to do it but I knew it was, and we're on the top floor, it's like a row house, and we were on the top floor, was the third floor apartment. And in the kitchen there was a fire escape with steps. I went downstairs and then of the hallway next between the kitchen, the bedroom, there's a stairwell that went down, you know, through the common area. Yeah, and I asked the sheriff I said listen man can I call my grandma? Tell her what's going on because she's the one that you know bailed me out. I don't want to worry about me. Do you mind if I just called for a minute? And he said, no, no problem at all because I was acting very pleasant, you know, very compliant, no b*******. And I got on the phone and I didn't even call her. I just pretend that I didn't. I am just talking to like that are, I am just talking. And just trying to figure out what I am going to do, is the bail, bonds guy was standing by the door that goes out to the fire escape, and the sheriff was at the other door, to the kitchen, that led to the hallway that went down the steps, and I just kept talking to kept talking. And the sheriff asked me if I would, he said, man, you gotta hang up. I was like, all right, just a second, they said, and he's like, man, you got to hang up now and I said, all right man, just a sec and I kept talking, he came around behind me. What you should have done, because any left, the left me a path to the hallway, and he reached around and grab my hand, there was on the phone. Yeah, I spun around and pick his ass up and throw him on the kitchen table. And then spun back around down the hallway. Down the steps, out to the alley. And I went down to It's called The Schuylkill River, which is a fairly large river in the Philadelphia area. And I am figuring, you know, they're gonna be looking for, Me now.

Speaker 1

31:08

 Okay.

Speaker 2

31:09

 Yeah, I just threw this to, I just threw this, Deputy over the kitchen table. So they're probably looking for me.

Speaker 1

31:13

 Took this to the next level. Yep. And.

Speaker 2

31:16

 And then it was just, you know, I got to get the f*** out of here. So the river was too big to cross. Like I you know I would have drowned if I don't try to cross it but there was a bridge that went across the river, sorry about the traffic you hear that. So there was a bridge that went across River but it was a pretty far away across and I thought I can't leave myself exposed by going Over top of the river because it's going to be easy to spot me. And, so I went up and climbed up underneath the bridge where they have these girders that go across. And I kind of like just hold on and just kind of wiggle my way across and got to the other side of the river there were it sounds like s*** on TV. There was there were true near railroad tracks and there's a freight train going down the railroad, and he was going pretty fast. Probably like I am gonna guess 15 miles an hour, because my top speed for like 5 seconds is 15 miles an hour. Like someone there. All right. And I was running as fast as I could. And it might have been a little slower, maybe 12 miles an hour, it was only grab when I was running as fast as I could. Try to grab one of this train, didn't know where it was going, didn't care? I am just going to hop on it. I will hop off whether it's, you know, the next day. Two days later, I can be in Kansas. I don't give an s*** get out of here. But I was afraid to like, I was just barely keeping up and I thought, man, if I fall like, I might like it, my arms cut off, like, like this is like this isn't working and So I stopped chasing a train and a backtrack, there was another town on the other side of the bridge and I can't remember what it was called. I was in Norristown. That's where I started. And I can't remember what the other town was, but I just thought I was walking around. I am like nana, I need a ride, you know, and I am just thinking, like, I am going to jack somebody, I don't know what I am gonna do, but I need to get out of here and there was a walking through this little neighborhood. And there was a car that just pulled up in front of this Pharmacy, and they double-parked in the street and left. The motor running, and he went to the pharmacy, and I was like, there's my ride, it's like the Law of Attraction, right? I just attracted to Jack and I went in hopped in and took off, and I am heading back to Baltimore and it's a funny story. There was a kid that was hitchhiking and I pick them up. People, people used to hitchhike back in the seventies and eighties. I don't know if it's like all over the.

Speaker 1

33:30

 Place through a know. My father's told me stories about that. Yeah.

Speaker 2

33:34

 And This kids a, so I can I pick them up? We're driving and, and I told him and if it's like the all over the place, and he's like, yeah. And I said, yeah, I found an easier way like I don't really hitchhike anymore. He's like really, what are you doing? I was like well, I steal cars, and he said really I was like yeah just stole this one and that would have been like that would have been a great Instagram pic, right?

Speaker 1

34:06

 Before memes were thing.

Speaker 2

34:07

 Yeah I guess so. Drop them off a little while later I made my way back to Baltimore. No money. I got a car. I got a bunch of money back at my apartment but my girlfriend even know about And wouldn't, you know, the very next day the feds raided our apartment. Wow, found the money found had, how old were you at this point? I think 24 verse 19. It was 1989, got it right? And yeah, that was an August, something like that, 89. It may be the very beginning, very beginning of August. And.

Speaker 1

34:45

 Then, and I don't mean to step on your toes here. If we can fast-forward a little bit because I know you On The Good Deeds episode. We hit several other stories that were critical. I remember several things where, like, the attorney when you were in jail, and I think I am into that cab driver, I am sorry. That those were critical key points and I don't want to, I don't want to miss, those.

Speaker 2

35:08

 Sure. So. So what happened was at that point, I kind of gave it up and I just thought, well, I am just going to get Hyderabad. I like, I am just gonna, I am going to rob stores every day or whatever. I will steal it. Different, you know, still different car every day and I will just do this until I either get shot or overdose. Like there was now like jail was never an option. It's either. I am going to get shot, or I am going to OD like that's it. And I am just going to keep this is what I am choosing to do. And after it was September, I think it was September 8th, September 7th of 89. I decided that I was going to go out to Alaska. They had this Alaska out Valdez like oil spill, and they were hiring anybody. Is about like white boil off the dogs rocks, and whatever. I am just like, man. I will go hide in Alaska, I get a job and you know, I thought I would just like, I will just try this, you know, stolen cars out there and what I did, you can't do this anymore. But you can go fill your tank with gas and just take off like now you gotta pay first back then. Yeah, you know, and I was just pull it tagging and take off and I mean that's how I got like I stole a car and Georgia made it to Pennsylvania, just doing just that he's so wasn't a big deal. And I mean, it's a terrible thing to do, but it was very, very simple, doing sure. And, so I just started robbing stores like every day. Yeah, it went a lot of money if you want a box here, if you want a box there. But, you know if you're a junkie and you're broke three hundred dollars is a lot of money. And in September 7th, I decided I am going to go out to California and or Alaska, and I talked to a girlfriend and I just told her what I was going to do her and I have been friends for years, and she was, you know, kind of Hardcore, like I was, and I said, well, let us go hang out tonight, so I went and got a motel room. Adam, it's called Pulaski Highway in the Baltimore area and went out and that night, you know, I had some money from previous robberies, went bought, some drivers, got a hotel room or getting high and then I thought was, you know, it's go rob something else. So we left the hotel remote I will when Rob another store went bald some drugs on our way back to the motel. And I ran a red light in the stolen car and ended up. It's a make the long story short I ended up getting call you know I got boxed in I.

Speaker 1

37:33

 Couldn't escape there were cars in.

Speaker 2

37:35

 Front of me it's like 2:00 in the morning, September 8th with the like I am thinking like the f*** are all these people going. I mean Jesus Christ you know like I got no space to navigate and encourage stolen. It was like a 280Z or something is really fast cars. I thought if I get an opening like I am out of here.

Speaker 1

37:51

 And.

Speaker 2

37:54

 And so, you know, they got us boxed in. And the cops are like jumping out with their guns out and the lights on and all this. The I asked Barbara said that, hey, barking the drugs, she gave him to me, and I am just thinking, like, look, I am not going out like this. Like, they're gonna have to shoot my ass, like, I am not just getting out and, and, like, turning myself in. So I got out of open the door to put my arms up, and I looked around at the, it for an opening. And then I just took off running. And I mean, I remember like gritting my teeth like just thinking, like, man, if they f****** shoot me, like, just keep f****** her. No matter what, just keep f****** running because I am going to get a jail for the rest of my f****** life. That's what I am thinking. And it's like, sure I would write a rather bleed out in the street, right? And spend the next 50 years in jail, and I ain't seen.

Speaker 1

38:44

 It sounds crazy to say, but it seems logical.

Speaker 2

38:47

 It did to me. I mean, it's a tough choice. It's like, you know if you want to go out tonight, or you want to spend the rest of your life in prison? I will die tonight. Right? And you know, few minutes later I ended up getting called. Yeah. I kind of got trapped in this like little No Warehouse complex where there was like nowhere to go. And I ended up I got called and went to jail, you know, and I can I admitted to everything I mean like at a bank bag, not from a bank, but if I could drop back from a store that had robbed and like, it was obvious that, you know, I was up to no good and I had the feds at a warrant for my arrest and all this stuff. I think I left that part out, the feds raided my apartment, the day after I escaped from the sheriff. And, you know, my girlfriend found out about everything So that kind of felt that kind of f*** their relationship up a little bit. It's just wind up in, you know, I confessed everything and part of the reason I did it because I didn't want the girl that was with to get like blame for anything. So I just like look man she's has nothing to do with this. She's just a girl hanging out with like I will tell you everything. I did. She got like you got to cut her loose, right? Right. And so they agreed and I admitted liking things like 23 or Eight robberies, in Baltimore City, Baltimore County, Harford County, Carroll County and a bunch of cars and all this other stuff and you know some sitting in the county jail. And you know I have got you know I am looking at literally like hundreds of years and I thought all right, well I am not done, you know, there's I will get out of here. I will figure out a way to get out and I attempted to escape from that. She will and I mean, like I missed it by that much, you know, thank God. But I managed to break a piece of Steel off of one of the bunk beds, which was about four feet, long thick. And, in my cell I tried they have this really heavy-duty mesh security screen a pride that whole full frame off and all that. And then there was this heavy-duty like cast iron, like mesh behind. That attach to the window, I am not kept praying at that. I got a hole in it. Big enough for, you know me and a couple of other people like you could fit a time as long as you didn't, we like 300 pounds and then I was using this piece of Steel and prying out the plastic. It was plexiglass prying that out when they rolled in and called us. And I mean, it's like three, four, five minutes. We'd have been out of there and it wouldn't just been me. I was on a high Bill section like, everybody at a hundred thousand dollar bail and off. I think my tail was like 600 Thousand dollars like everybody, it would have been like a hundred guys going through that window. 100 skinny guys going through the window so the bad guys can still be in jail with, and they called us and I went, you know, so then I ended up getting put on lock on for six months. Which means, like you're locked in a Cell by yourself, you know, 23 hours a day. You get out an hour to get, take a shower and just walk around that you can imagine. Yeah. And that, that was really good for me, that it worked Like that because then the thing had happened that began to change. For me, was, I went and my attorney came in, and my parents stepped up. Got me an attorney, and he came in to see me, and we're sitting this little conference room. There's like, a metal table between us and I will never forget it. I mean, because he really made me feel stupid, he looked at me, and he said, man, what the f*** is wrong with you? Like can't you even stay out of trouble in jail, like you're already locked up? Uh-huh. And then he said, don't you realize that if you do what you're supposed to do, you can be home by the time, you're 30 years old, you will be young enough to start a whole new life. And I never, I hadn't considered that you hadn't thought about it like that before, right? Five Years. Start only life like really like, is that an option, huh? And I mean, I didn't say that to him at the time, but I right over the next course of the next couple days, I really thought about that. And I thought, okay, I am going to give this s*** a try and part of in part of the thing that really made a difference was my friend Barb. Who was with me when I got locked up. Yeah, she had managed to get like a few weeks clean like a maybe a month clean. I have to be at locked up. She started hanging out with the first guy I ever shot. Goat with that went to a drug rehab, and he had like two or three months clean. And now she's hanging out with him, and she's getting her stuff together and nobody done that. I didn't know anybody who ever got clean, right? And, so I am seeing like, then it's possible. Like you can get off the drugs. Yeah. And young enough to start a whole new life and that's what's the mindset started the team.

Speaker 1

43:33

 Exactly. This is the critical piece. I mean, it's so many things, I could, I could, you know, we could talk about from here. I remember in the previous episode, on the other on Good Deeds, we talked about several different kind of pivoting moments or really critical moments in your life and this was obviously one of them if not the.

Speaker 2

43:56

 Biggest, it was huge, I mean, but then there's one other thing that happened. There're three pizzas three pieces to it. The next thing that happened is after I got off lockup, like I committed myself, like I am going to figure this out, like I don't know what I want to do. Drugs didn't work or you know, drugs, obviously don't work rehabs, don't work, jail, didn't work because I have been a prisoner for the ministry. Sudden work different churches doesn't work, different car, friends in different states that no, I got to figure something out, I don't know what it is, but I got to figure something out. And then I found the book. O'Reilly's called you can if you think you can get along with tier one table and I didn't like I didn't know they had self-help books. Like I don't know if it's a new industry or what but I didn't it.

Speaker 1

44:34

 Happen. I think it's grown a lot. Yeah.

Speaker 2

44:36

 Yeah. And I looked at it and if you think you can, I was like, I got plenty of f****** time writing. I am going to read. I think I have already read every Stephen King book in the jail. So let me go ahead and read this thing and halfway through that book, Something clicked in my head and I realized that I can take control of my life and become the person that I want to become, but I have to believe in myself and up into that point. I didn't believe in myself because I was always focusing on my failures and halfway through this book. I was smoking, cigarettes back, then you could smoke in jail back then and halfway through the book, I am like, man. F*** this. I am taking control of my life, I am taking over, I am going to run this s***, I am gonna run, not the drugs me and Ike, right? Look my half pack. Regrets out and I gave it to this guy. Frank retainer, son, Frank and f****** gone changing my life and of course, you know. They're, you know, it's like all heard that before, you know, he's taking.

Speaker 1

45:28

 Everything. Right. Sure. Yeah.

Speaker 2

45:30

 But uh, that's what.

Speaker 1

45:32

 Happened. And that's, that's really I mean, it's yeah, this mindset shift. It may not have happened in one minute. I mean, there were, it was over time but there were critical whether there was a.

Speaker 2

45:43

 Time yet, I gotta tell you. Look at that in that through that book there was like there was a time, it was Has an instant like I do. Like it was like that, it wasn't like a dimmer switch like slowly going on and off, it might have been a camera like preparing or fertilizing, my mind for this pair. Once I read that one thing, yeah, it convinced me like man, I got this, I got it and you can imagine. Like, I mean, this is in, this isn't just with like drugs off, this is with everything in life. Like, you know, just like you guys are gonna get a boxing ring. Yeah, and one guy's thinking in his head, like, man, this guy's gonna kick my ass. Hit me in the face, man. I hope you don't ya like he already lost. Fight you already done, right? This, if the same guy goes in with the attitude, man, I am going to kill this guy. I want to tear his face off with Mom and get into whom. Yeah, when I am done, he still might get your ass kicked but to chances of winning or significantly greater if you believe in.

Speaker 1

46:36

 Yourself. Yeah, absolutely. It's the knowing it's the fuel, that's really what I want. This podcast, not just this episode, but this whole podcast to be about it really is about the mental. All the mindset piece, you know, real estate was you're in, you know, we're not going to go into the Weeds on how you did all your real estate stuff. But that was your you know, kind of asset class or strategy as far as how you were able to build wealth and that kind of thing, but kind of doesn't really matter. You know if you didn't have the mindset, these down real estate, never would have happened.

Speaker 2

47:11

 You're in the mindsets, everything credible. And you have to start where I started.

Speaker 1

47:15

 You know. Yeah. You know. Right? Right. It's still up. Eyes to people who haven't robbed twenty-three or Twenty Eight. Yes. You know, Banks and cars.

Speaker 2

47:24

 And I gotta tell you, man, the, this is one of the things that I did, anybody, anyone that's listening to this, you can do this. This isn't like magic or anything, like up until this point, and this is something that I did myself up into this point. When I thought about, who am I? I just thought of all my failures and losses and things that are f***** up and people that I lied to and people that are hurt and that's what I used to define, who I am. The kind of person I am Then I decided I am going to, you know, it sounds corny, but I am gonna flip the script right? I am gonna look at this thing. I am going to sit down, and I am going to write down all the good things that I have ever done that. I can think of any good, be a long list. It's me a short list.

Speaker 1

48:02

 But those what you're going to focus on that's when that's what you.

Speaker 2

48:04

 Want, right? Right. And that's what I did in the first thing on the list was a quit smoking cigarettes that was.

Speaker 1

48:09

 The front. That's yeah, I mean and this is when I say this is going to it's going to sound so much less dramatic, you know, but I had a similar shift. Of you know, just I was going to work every day, had the nine-to-five job with long commute and that I didn't have a terrible life. I am not saying that right but I would I just kind of fell into the Trap of kind of Groundhog Day and that this is what life is kind of thing. And then I, you know, realized I started pointing to my strengths and the people in my life that you know, that could help me and kind of just my focus changed. And so it became more about teamwork and growth and strengths and looking at the positive and that for me was a critical piece. This was back in. You know, 2013 2014 just to start really kind of ratcheting up. Real estate and note investing and things like that. But again, not as dramatic story but it was really important because I could have easily just gotten caught in, you know, ho-hum woe is me. This is my life and that kind of thing. So, the mindset piece is.

Speaker 2

49:15

 Critical. Yeah, I don't yet, people don't, I mean, like, people don't have to apologize like, well, you know, wasn't that bad? Like it's, this isn't a competition. It's just not right. You know, it's I regret all of that stuff. Tough. But surely if it wasn't for that, I might not be here today and I have tilted the scales where I think I have done more good than bad now. Yeah. And but I just there're some things I want to mention that it did to Mayor Orton. Please help people to heal is like maybe 12 years ago or so. I looked up the cop. That arrested me. I look them up on Facebook and I found him. Yeah, and I sent them a message and said, hey, did you used to work in eastern district, Baltimore city police? And he didn't respond. And he's probably like you now and then I, you know, sending another message a couple weeks later and I said, listen, you arrested me September 8th, 1989 on Monument Street Corner, monument and crossing and you saved my life and I just want you to know that I am. Truly sorry for all the s*** that I ever did and that's not how I was raised and that's not the kind of person I am. And I just Surely regret all of it and I just want to thank you because you saved my life and I appreciate it. And, Not too long after that, I got a response from, and we're friends that I met we have met booked week and I have got to talk to him. Maybe six months ago, his number in my phone, they were friends today and.

Speaker 1

50:53

 So, it was that, was that difficult? I mean to me? Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 2

50:59

 Now, because I am that for me is, like, it's healing for me to express, you know, to tell people how to feel like my remorse and regret. Gotcha. But when the difference I die, All the attorney that like said that life-changing thing to me.

Speaker 1

51:15

 Yeah, he spoke truth in to you.

Speaker 2

51:17

 Is, what do you and I haven't talked to him since 1990. This is, I mean, this is like really funny, but I called him, I he's still practicing law. He's got to be 100 years old, right? And I found him in the phone book and I called his office, and he got on the phone. You know the ladies like well is he expecting a call from me? And I was like, well probably not wood which case is this involving? I was like well you know, it's a case from like, you know, 1989. All right, and she put them on the phone and I just relate the story to him and I just told him how you know the comments that he made a change, my life. And this is where I am at today. Like, you know, I have a great life. I am a respected member contributing member of society, have an amazing son, like, you know, it's like, I have got good friends like good people that, that, I hang out with, and, and I just wanted him to know that might not have happened. If he hadn't said what he had like, I, that was like.

Speaker 1

52:12

 It's a.

Speaker 2

52:12

 Huge impact made a huge impact. For me, that didn't know it at the time, but he told me that I was actually on speaker, like, after I told him, it's like his whole audience, his whole office. Yap, like heard This conversation, and he didn't say it. But it sounded to me like he was becoming emotional back to the mat, just hearing it sure. I mean, I still do when I talk about it because it's such a life-changing thing that I am so grateful for. But I mean, I cannot yeah, I.

Speaker 1

52:45

 Mean it's I am sure he has done well financially and all that but I would guess a phone call like that would be, you.

Speaker 2

52:54

 Know, more important than any of that. I am sure when he was sat down with his, you know, significant other for dinner that night. Yeah, he said something to the effect of guess who called me today.

Speaker 1

53:09

 That wasn't your every day, your average Tuesday.

Speaker 2

53:12

 But you know, my point is and I have done this with other people under other circumstances. It's never too late to call somebody up and apologize or to thank them for something you have. Somebody did something meaningful in your life, you know, even if it was a ball, said Burger King 20 years ago, and they said something that made a positive impact in your life. It's never too late to get find those people and let them know you will make their day. You will make their day when you do that.

Speaker 1

53:37

 Yeah. And it makes my day.

Speaker 2

53:39

 Happens to me sometimes when people call me up and you know, tell me they heard this podcast and it like made a difference in their life like me. And that's what it's all about mean. That's what else makes it worth it. We.

Speaker 1

53:48

 Could we sure could use a lot more of that given the last just the general, you know, dynamic of how things are with social media and People tearing each other down and there's too much of that going on, keyboard Warriors you know bashing people and yeah, the only online mob and so yeah, I mean that's I love it. It's so that's that would be fantastic if we could get more of a movement like that.

Speaker 2

54:12

 People were probably we run an.

Speaker 1

54:14

 Over, we are running over a little bit. You know, we may end up, I don't know, maybe we will break this into two episodes but yeah, I mean, I have got a few more questions we can run through real fast. Plenty of time. Yeah, I mean so just to kind of finish up the so you just the, the very short version of, you know, where did you go when you after you made that mindset shift, then you got into real estate and then you had all the and you ended up quitting your job. I know there's a ton of detail in there, you know that we're skipping over. But if you could just give the 30 seconds synopsis of what happened from the mindset shift, to where you are today.

Speaker 2

54:53

 Sure. So, that mindset shift happened, is either. April 20th to 22nd 1990. I stayed in prison for other liver for years. I got locked up, September 89, I got out in June of 94. So however many months that is, I think it's like four years and nine months before I got out, I had got a two-year degree in Business from a local Junior from you know, Community College. They actually have the instructors. Come to the prison with the same book. Same exams, everything's the same. It's just, you're in prison and got a construction certificate where you're like, learning how to frame. Houses and, you know, just all that stuff and I just figured I got to do the time but that doesn't mean I have to waste it. Like I am going to make. I am going to make them the best use of this time. So when I get out of them is best prepared as I can. Be to take one like a whole new life. Yeah. And right before I got out, I may be six months before I got out. This is another this is really important. Lesson is I wrote a letter to my high school girlfriend that I had broken up with in high school and I broke up with her because I knew where I was going like a new like, I am a loser, and she's going to get a college and have a great life and like, I can't change. And, so I broke up with her but I would always regret breaking up with her. I mean, I was in love with her, and she was just such an amazing woman. And, so I wrote a like, maybe six months for got out and just have still remembered her address. I mean, like this was before email and all that stuff, and I wrote her a letter and just told her how things turned out, and she wrote me back and said, you know, I am doing great. Graduated from school. Got a great job and apartment got a boyfriend. Don't ever write me again. She's and Actually she had broken up with her boyfriend. She didn't tell me that at the time and then let her. And so I got that response. I was just grateful. I got a response. Yeah it kind of gave me some closures like I was able to say the things I wanted to say. Yeah. And but then I thought to myself, I didn't say everything. Like I didn't really tell her the real stuff and since she's not going to talk to me anymore and I don't blame her. Let me just get in. Tell her I want to go deep and just tell her why I did what I did and how I felt about it and I will probably never talk to her again. But at least I have this off my conscience like this is off my plate, and so I wrote her you took a few days to get the letter just right and then dropped in the mail. Couple weeks later. I got a response. Well, you know, we can talk, we can write in a month or two later. She was carved to see me. And then a few months later, I got out of jail and a couple months later were living together, and a couple years later, we got married. We're never supposed to be traveling nurse. Yeah. And so, the point of that story is like, man. If somebody says like no, he's got a, you know, he's got to find a different way. To ask the question. I think that? Yeah, yeah, that's because.

Speaker 1

57:49

 You have been, you have shown that you're, you have been Forceful your entire life. I mean you always figured out a way to make it happen, you know. Whether but the big thing was you were maybe going down in the kind of — dark path before.

Speaker 2

58:05

 And you have changed that your direction. I think that you develop a lot of skills when you head in that direction like a lot of life-saving skills rain just as an example I got to Florida it's like to Jacksonville, and so I got nothing and no money nowhere to go, no food. And I am thinking I got to get a job. But if we get a job then I am not going to get paid for a couple of weeks and I can't go to the shelters and the missions to get lunch and stuff like that because I am at.

Speaker 1

58:33

 Work. Are you have a johrei, right? Yep, sure.

Speaker 2

58:35

 So I can't go two weeks without eating and I can, you know, I can't go into grocery stores every night and steal food which is another thing I used to do it. We just grab food and go and sneak it in the bathroom. Eat it right in the grocery store. And I mean, that includes like real hot dogs and cheese, like, it doesn't matter. You know, it's like when you're hungry, it doesn't matter if it's wrong. Heart dog. And so then I got this thoughts like, okay, I am not getting paid for two weeks but I need to eat. What if I get a job in a place that sells food Can I can eat at work, that's what I think. Yeah. I got a job working at a hot dog stand. And yeah, yeah, it's just like so, a lot of times people like my wife does this all the time. She just sees obstacles. You can't do this. I am just like right now. Wait a minute. Hold up, you.

Speaker 1

59:21

 Know, I will find a way around this. And.

Speaker 2

59:24

 That's and that's my skill is figuring out how you go over it. Around it behind your honor, it blow it up. Like I am 40. I will go all the long way around. Whatever it is. There's an Away. And just suggest to people like never give up, man. I don't care if you're trying to lose weight and you keep falling off. The thing you're trying to quit drinking York, wanted trying to quit smoking in and you just keep you know, failing like don't stop man, just don't stop and don't give up, you're worth so much more. It is just worth, you're worth so much more and people don't realize how much they're failures, how they can turn. That in the something where they can help so many people with their stories, you know, because they're not the only ones that fail, we all fail, I still fail at stuff, but you can take those failures and turn them into strengths and make a difference in people's.

Speaker 1

01:00:17

 Lives. I mean, that's from adversity to abundance. That's, that's the name of the podcast, right? And.

Speaker 2

01:00:23

 That's exactly.

Speaker 1

01:00:24

 Exactly really is. I mean, you know, that's the whole point of this, this show is, you know, you may not see it at the time when you're going through the struggles, and I am not suggesting you necessarily choose to go through.

Speaker 2

01:00:37

 Struggles, and I wouldn't suggest if you do it on purpose.

Speaker 1

01:00:41

 But you can use those, you know, you know, in a way that maybe other people can't. I mean, because you have been through that you have developed these, these strengths, and these personal personality traits and things. You know, you can use that experience to now, help others. So as we move toward the, the end of the show here, I am going to, these are going to be a kind of lightning round quick questions. Okay, you know. What is a book or two that you'd recommend to my audience and?

Speaker 2

01:01:08

 Why I would say assuming that they are not starting where I started Rich Dad. Poor Dad, nice heel of Italy. Number of probably number one. Yeah. If you're like a business-oriented entrepreneurial kind of person because that is going to just expose a lot of the BS that we have been brainwashed, with since birth in this country. So that's probably one of the that's probably the main one. I could probably in five others. That's the main one.

Speaker 1

01:01:33

 God, It. How about a movie? I don't know if you watch movies or anything. Any good.

Speaker 2

01:01:37

 Movies, you know?

Speaker 1

01:01:41

 How about this movie or a movie? Or a podcast?

Speaker 2

01:01:43

 You pick one, one of my favorite movies. It's a fiction movie was called Starman with Jeff Bridges. Okay. And it's a tearjerker. So but that's like when people ask me what my favorite movie is, that's always one that pops up. All.

Speaker 1

01:01:55

 Right? The worst ones.

Speaker 2

01:01:56

 Jobs so you're the worst. One was.

Speaker 1

01:02:00

 Jaws. Yeah man. Yeah, I never yeah. I never got into that one. What's one question? You wish I would ask you but I haven't answered. I haven't asked.

Speaker 2

01:02:09

 Oh, man. You know, there's nothing really. I mean I wish I could give you like a real smart, you know. Yeah, whatever answer. But yeah, I am open man, would.

Speaker 1

01:02:23

 Love it. We have covered so much ground and I really do feel like they got so much to unpack with your story. It's incredible. There's no way we could cover it all in one episode here, but so, and then we have already touched on this somewhat. But how do you like to serve others? How are you adding value to others? These days?

Speaker 2

01:02:41

 One way is like this. Like doing that. So I mean I don't get paid for this. This is my most valuable asset is time. Sure. Exactly. It's a limited resource. Yeah. But if I can spend my time doing something like this where I might potentially reach you know maybe hundreds or thousands of people that out, we will never meet and it can have a positive effect on their lives. Yeah, like, that's to me, that's a gift for that. I can, it is able to actually do that as a gift for me, it's kind of selfish because it makes me feel good to help other people. In ways by is by talking me. I give money to Charities and stuff like that, but that's for sure. I think time is more valuable than the money and I agree. So, I would say that. That's what I do is I just try to influence people and inspire people to live their best lives. I.

Speaker 1

01:03:28

 Love it. Now that goes into the next, the final question here, where can our listeners find you online? Because I know you do have a YouTube channel and some other things going on. What do you have going on and where can people reach out to you? Okay.

Speaker 2

01:03:40

 So yeah I have got a YouTube channel the best thing to do. Would be to just email me directly Mark at Mark, Owens.com and asked me if you're looking for my YouTube channel, send you a link because I can't remember the name of it. I have got to have Facebook group for Real Estate Investors. There's a page in a group just if you do search, its Market Owens. REI and just the group is there, I think there's like a thousand people and at the pages, just like a place order. So yeah, okay. Don't waste your time with that. And those emails probably the best way, and then, if you tell me what you're looking for, whether it's YouTube, Facebook, Instagram whatever. Yeah and I can just answer you directly. Perfect.

Speaker 1

01:04:18

 Now you're going to be in Charleston for the foreseeable future.

Speaker 2

01:04:24

 The I am going to be in Charleston for my wife's contract. Is she starts another one, it's in April, May and June I am staying till the beginning of June, then I am heading out the Leadville Colorado for am off to train at elevation, because I am going to be going to Kings Peak, which is the highest mountain in Utah. Bora, which is the highest mountain in Idaho. I have got a permit to climb Whitney, which is the highest mountain in the lower 48 states, which is in California. And I am going to do, Andre peak in Nevada. So I am going to do the highest point in four different states.

Speaker 1

01:04:57

 In July. So that's, that's my plans for July. So cool. All right. Well, there's so much more we could dive into, but we will have to save that for we can get you back on another time. This has been really, really good Mark. I mean, I just love this. I just love your, you know, I hate You had to go through all that, I mean, obviously like you said some of that was, maybe your own here and doing that. But.

Speaker 2

01:05:19

 It was all my own doing, man. It's I mean, it's the only way that you can change your life as if you accept a hundred sponsibility for what you do and I always have a never blamed. Anybody else I made the choices.

Speaker 1

01:05:29

 I mean it's you know I know you say you don't want to compare but that's some serious adversity that you overcame and you went through and now, I mean, you know, you're definitely seems from my perspective. You're living an abundant life I am sure you have struggles like everybody else, right? But you have got free time and it sounds like you got Financial Freedom from your real estate and other endeavors. So, I mean definitely come a long way and I really feel like this is going to inspire a lot of people. So I really just want to thank you for coming on Mark.

Speaker 2

01:06:01

 And.

Speaker 1

01:06:02

 Spending your most valuable resource with us, which is your time. So, thanks a lot.

Speaker 2

01:06:07

 Hey, thank you, Jamie. Thank you for having me. Be happy to come back. Anytime in the future if you want to continue the discussion.

Speaker 1

01:06:12

 Sounds And to our listeners out there please go out and rate and review our show. We love it. We're in a growth phase obviously, so we appreciate you listening. Take care, everyone.

Speaker 2

01:06:26

 Thanks so much for tuning in to.

Speaker 1

01:06:27

 This episode of the form adversity to abundance podcast. If you're enjoying the show, please feel free to rate, subscribe and leave a review wherever you listen to your podcast that helps others find the show, and we greatly appreciate it. Thanks again for listening, and we will catch you in the next.

Speaker 2

01:06:44

 Episode.